Route Grade Votings
Total votes cast 382
A mini-classic, and a great little route following the crack cleaving the bulges. It is jug-pulling once the initial awkward roof is passed but this is a real struggle for many.
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I was very surprised to see this down graded.
Now a sandbag.
This has always been a very soft VS. Getting past the low bulge is the bombproof protected 4b crux (hence HS) and the 4a jug fest above is also well protected. Compare this to Crack and Corner at the Roaches.
Never HS. Compare with 3 tree (HS) and something like terrace crack VS or gargoyle buttress. This felt harder than those.
Top Route and no doubt HS 4B.
Excellent but only HS. The first move is tricky but with overhead gear. After that it is about Vdiff.
I thought this was definitely HS, the crux is at the bottom with overhead gear and the holds are huge for the top bit, with decent gear. its just a bit steep.
I don't usually agree with grading VS 4b routes which are sustained and/or intimidating, but this is surely the 'definitive' VS 4b? Would get MVS in Yorkshire.
Can't understand why this was downgraded. The start is harder than the "4c" start to Crack and Corner at the Roaches, and in a more serious/intimidating position. VS 4b it is.
the start is pretty straightforward really, what makes it difficult is hesitant leaders trying to place friends only 3 moves off the deck, causing themsleves a nightmare. much easier if you ju go for it and be forcefull, theres a rest just above.
It didn't think it got much easier even after the start. The promised jugs don't appear until you virtually at the top, the rest is pretty sustained jamming. The route's got a better claim to be VS 4b than most other routes that are given this grade for reasons other than lack of gear.
I thought this was easier than and inferior to Crack & Corner @ The Roaches. Worth doing for the start though. Great pro. HS 4b felt about right.
Brilliant climb, Bit of a struggle to start, but finsh much easier than it looks. HS 4c sounds about right to me (4c for the start)
Was stunned yesterday when we go a new guidebook to find this was only HS. Start feels too committing to me for HS.
I thought i was becoming a confident HS leader until i tried this and couldn't do the strat, i got totally pumped placing gear and had to come down. Perhaps I should have just gone for it, but my jamming is poor (another major problem here), and I was likely to come off. If the start was 4b I would give this route HS since its off the deck despite being above a bad landing, but it aint. I found it considerably harder that anything on Knights move (5a), so it should it get at least 4c despite my lack of proficient jamming. Its basically a roof-crack for gods sake!
Thought that HS 4b is pretty much spot on fro the grade, I wasn't a great jammer when I did the route and found it OK. The landing shouldn't matter, there's excellent gear the whole way.
It may well be 4c/5a/even harder if you don't jam, but routes are graded for the easiest method, which in this case is 4b jamming!
Iíd have possibly agreed with HS 4b a few years ago, but after doing it at the weekend found it hard for that grade. I think if youíre climbing regularly particularly at a harder grade this route is a jug-fest. However if youíre trying to progress through the grades or not feeling too strong this route is defiantly VS 4b. the lower section (crux) is strenuous and if you donít do quickly you soon tire. The upper bulges are straight forward but can feel intimidating on the first time.
A good, genuine Hard Severe. Good climbing, 4b, solid gear and good rests.
Having finally managed this today (first time now) Id change my opinion to VS 4c. I still don't except 4b for the start although its not as hard as I originally thought. I'd say VS because by the time its at all easy to place any gear after the start you are a long way off the ground, plus gear placement is difficult after the mid-way rest because its overhanfing and strenuous (despite jugs).
Definitely HS 4b - the start isn't that hard so long as you commit to it (sorry, but if you can't commit to it then you can't call yourself an HS climber). It's got great gear all the way up and the top is easy but steep - place some good gear before you start the final section and just go for it. Course, getting through the 6 foot snow drift that covered the holly tree on Sunday would have added a grade or 2...
Better climbing than Topsail on Birchen, possibly not as photogenic.
It's a soft touch VS and a hard HS so maybe putting it near the top of their HS list is correct. There is really very little need to jam in this unfortunately, due to there being edges on the insides of the crack, gear is easy to place all the way up and the jugs are enormous. There's even a nice seat to belay from by the holly.
Awarkward move from under the low roof, after that it's a bit of a jug pulling exercise...feels good though!
Throughout the summer i have climbed five V.S.'s without incident, most sunday's, and led Knights Move(H.V.S.)clean the same day that i "decked" warming up on this supposed H.S. (I was ok and got back on to lead it on my second attempt but it is (in my opinion) a V.S.
Climbed this as an easy end to a day of VS's and it was the pumpiest of the day! Great route, a mild one, but definitly VS.
Climbed this today after climbing Hell Crack (Stanage) a few days ago. Believe me, if Hell Crack is VS (which it is) then this is definitely HS. After you're over the first bulge it's plain sailing. It's certainly got nothing on Gritstone's Definitive VS crack The File which I won't dare go near.
Even after 10,000 plus grit routes I still think this is VS, for the intimidation factor if for nothing else. Got the start wrong once & had to jump off, despite being well used to VS at the time.
If this route isn't VS then inverted v on stanage should also be HS. Fantastic route defiantly my favourite on burbage, 3 stars.
It can't be VS, because I led it without sh**ing myself. Get the lovely jams in and it's probably right for HS 4b
This was my first lead. Before this i had done a VDiff in the Mourn Mountains and that was it.
HS 4b any day of the week! Well worth the 3 stars, absolutely cracking climb and puts you in a lovely position before pulling over the top. Bottom moves didn't feel harder than 4b, just a bit committing and it's all there for you above, jug, jug, jug all the way!