Runners over the left hand edge of the slab are OFF ROUTE, and reduce this to an easy HVS. The only runners on this route are in the break at the top of the initial slab.
Graham - 04/Feb/02

I agree with Graham for the grades but it makes a better HVS than an E1 (if the runners are there why ignore them?)
Steve C - 08/Mar/02

Runners are only 12 inch away - not siderunners, just runners. Ignoring them doesn't make it E1, its a HVS/VS.
daveP - 19/Mar/02

One move wonder. Bit crap really, esp./ if compared to 3PS next door.
ANT... - 25/Mar/02

I thought this was much easier than 3PS. The route description doesn't mention the fact that the side runners are out & it seems daft to leave them out if they're there! Make it a nice HVS.
Paul Boradman - 25/Apr/02

The starting slab is the hardest bit technically. I agree, the runners around the corner are so close that it is very artificial to ignore them. Something should be mentioned in the guidebook. With the runners, agree it felt like HVS 5b.
Jon Croxford - 24/Jun/02

It's marginal E1 as a solo. If you are going to put runners on the left then use them as hand holds as well and claim a Severe.
Jonathan Prager - 30/Jun/02

I disagree with a lot of the comments here. I found the crux to be about 1-2m above the initial slab. I also think though it is unfortunate that it has 3PS right next door, it is still worth the star. Finaly I found 3PS a LOT easier.
D Berry - 06/Apr/03

Hmmmm off limit holds? Is this the minus ten wall?? A pleasant VS solo (with all the holds)!
Birkby - 13/Oct/03

I did this recently for the first time and thought it was a pleasant VS 5a/b.

If clean it would be even better.
sloper - 12/Nov/03

this was my first e1. the crux is low but interesting. agree that it feels more like vs or hvs.
leon skeldon - 08/Apr/04

I think it's a bit silly to say this has a harder move than 3PS, the crux moves are quite different. I found this route very much easier than its brother, but can see others might not.

First E1, and a good choice for *mine*.
Michael Hudson - 01/Apr/05

Another crap, dirty eliminate route like Four Pebble. Don't bother.
Robo - 13/Oct/05

Easier and far less worrying than three pebble. I'd say around HVS 5a, especially if you use the 'side' runner.
Andrew Barker - 06/Nov/05

A nice route, not really worth putting a rope on for tho. Wouldnt placing side runners be harder than just climbing it without, or do you use the giant flake to place the runners & therefore gain a S grade? Found it easier than 3pebble. Nice tho.
nathan lawrence - 23/Nov/05

The route as it appears in the old guidbook at E1 5b must be a solo avoiding the little corner crack. It's a silly eliminate and a one-move wonder and therefore not worth including in a selective guidbook (but it's a cool move and you'd hurt yourself if you fell off, so it's a bit of a buzz if you like that sort of thing). The little corner crack is about Severe, so to grade this HVS 5b means you're using the crack for runners but not holds, which is even more silly than doing the original eliminate. Why not just remove it from the book, cause it's not meant to include silly little routes with no line or purpose.
Jon Stewart - 07/Aug/06

Only one move, so not a starred route, technically I found it harder than 3PS, felt E1 to me.
Iain Thow - 17/Mar/07

Not that amazing and easy HVS with the side runners in. They are so near the route that there is no point avoiding them!
Matt1000 - 30/Sep/07

Not a particularly impressive line, as its early in the season and i dont do many E1 i agree its probably very soft at the grade.
shaun walby - 19/Apr/09

To ignore gear because it's 2 feet away from the line you're supposed to be climbing is a bit ridiculous. Place the gear, climb back down and do the moves at around VS 4c (that's how it felt to me anyway). Or just don't bother because it lacks any sense of enjoyment
Alex Elsworth - 04/Mar/10